Healthy Family
May 4, 2022

Dads Have Influence – Being The Dad You Wish You Had | Nick Adams

Cultural Indoctrination can seem so strong when it comes to influencing our children.

It's hard to be a father when you're running a business, and feel like you aren't doing a good job at home.

It may feel like you're failing and useless. But that's not really true. Dads have so much influence. More than they realize when it comes to their family and especially their kids.

No dad is perfect. But that's okay.

Nick Adams knows that more than anyone. Nick had a disengaged alcoholic father who eventually tried to kill him and his mother. Nick had minimal contact with his dad, but he also had many scars. But even though Nick's father was far from perfect, there were still many good things that he imprinted on Nick's life.

Dads influence their kids no matter what. For good or for bad, dads are influencing their children.

It's not about doing everything right. It's about making little steps of progress along the way. Many times, it's the very small intentional steps that go far and deep into your child's life.

Dads already have it hard enough. Even when we mess up, it's okay to ask for forgiveness from our kids.

Even that is valuable in teaching them and connecting with them. Nick wrote the book "Being The Dad You Wish You Had." Nick doesn't want to remind dads of what they're doing wrong. Nick wrote this book to encourage dads and help them make simple and achievable steps to becoming the dads they want to be. This is a great book to help dads parent well and establish long-standing connected relationships with their children.


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Dads Have Influence – Being The Dad You Wish You Had | Nick Adams

INTRO: I'm not trying to raise kids. I'm trying to raise healthy adults. it's not about this moment. it's about a lifetime. My goal was not to get my kids to 18 and push them out of my house. My goal is to get to 18, 20, 40 and still have relationship with him.

BRETT: What's going on this is Brett Snodgrass with another episode of The Iron Deep Podcast, and I have Nick Adams on the show with me today. What's going on Nick?  

NICK: -Hey man. Going great! How about you?

BRETT: Yeah man, super excited to interview you on this podcast! And yeah, thanks for being on the show. And guys we're gonna be  

NICK: -Definitely  

BRETT: -We're gonna be talking about being a dad today. And it's funny how this topic came up just more and more and more lately. I think for my own life, I'm a dad. A lot of our listeners are dads. And this is one of the just kind of things that men struggle with. Actually at the end of the day, men struggle with just this... the father... and being a dad. And I want to read just a little bit about Nick before I kind of just jump into this, Nick. But Nick, he's been a youth camp founder. He's a director. He's a pastor. He's been a business owner. He's been in the real estate world. Commercial... residential... landlord... He's written his first book about being "The Dad You Wish You Had: the Five Big Stones for Effective Fatherhood." And he's writing books now. He's writer. He's a business owner, pastor and now we're really just going to be talking about being a dad. And Nick, I'm going to tell you, I read your book and I think my first question is right off the bat... Because I know a lot of men struggle with being a dad, but here is something from your own childhood you talked about being a memory of being in a hotel. And you were concerned about your father finding you and killing you and your mother. So that's not something that is probably... that is the most surprising thing. I mean I've had, I've had challenging times with my dad, but can you tell us a little bit about this in your own childhood and relationship with your father.

NICK: -Sure. I mean, you know... it happened after church one night. And my mom and I had gone to church, and when we came out of the church, my dad was there in the parking lot. And he had a gun. And he was very drunk. And he was going to kill my mom, because he thought she was having an affair. And he was going to kill me. And not really sure how I was... why... I don't know what I had done. But anyway, it was... it was the two of us. And... and so we got in the back of a car, laid down. I was laying in the floorboard and... folks from the church, you know, kind of drove us down back roads in Tennessee, and we escaped. And then hid out in the hotel that you're talking about there for several days. And just... and then spent a couple of months hiding from my father.  Just kind of out of fear. And you know, one of the reasons that story is so important, I think to the book, is because in the book then I talk about all the things that I still learned from my father. The positives and... we have a very difficult relationship... you know. I mean, that was the difficult part. He wasn't a difficult person. He was a pretty nice guy, if he was sober. And you know, most of the time it... it wasn't exactly like that. But that was definitely... a scarring and a... memorable moment.

BRETT: -Yeah. Yeah definitely! And that just kind of like grabs... grapples...  grips your attention. And the other thing that just kind of grips again just going back to your relationship with your own father, I was reading through. And I think between the ages of 11 and your mid 40s that you never stayed the night Under One Roof with your father until that particular point. So you talk about just some of the different positives of your relationship, but obviously some struggles. Can you go deeper into that? Just your life from that pivotal moment... teenager into adulthood. Never really being under the same roof with your father until another moment in life. But talk to us about that.

NICK: - Yeah. I mean you know I think it's hard to know how much impact happens when you have that kind of of break in a relationship and um from like you said from the time I was about 11 until I was in my 40s my father and I never stayed the night under the same roof I would go see him on weekends um I mean after that first you know trying to to kill us there were months that I didn't see him and then you know that first reconnect was terrifying because I still was wasn't sure what it was going to look like if he was going to hurt me or try to use me to get to Mom or I just didn't know what any of that would actually look like so there's a whole lot of fear in that um but then as as we progressed through that relationship we you know we we got to the point that I would go see him every week every other week and spend most of a Saturday with him and and just hang out we we'd go fishing and he was a farmer and so I'd help him at the farm and you know I guess relatively normal interaction um but he had very little input into my life because I just saw him one day a week you know maybe two times a month maybe three times a month and and of course on holidays but not a deep connection for sure and that really continued kind of on that pace as I got older I really disconnected a little bit more CU life just gets busy you go to college you've got friends and your dating and just all the stuff you do and and and suddenly you know I might see Dad once a month maybe just for Father's Day holidays his birthday just really that started backing off some but after I got married and had grandkids um suddenly his interest changed you know and and he because he never really came to to my home until I had kids and then he started showing up and he'd bring the kids gifts and he'd want to hang out with the girls and you know play with them and and and that was really the beginning of a deeper reconnect you know is when I began to have children myself and then really just gradually over time we were able to reconnect and to um you know by the time that he was diagnosed with lung cancer um he came to live with my family and I and that's the first time that he was back we were back under the same room and and then he lived with us for about 3 months until uh he eventually passed away wow wellow can you talk about and I know you you know you to take him in he's going through this uh very difficult time um obviously at the end of his life and you talked about this deeper reconnect what were some of the things and maybe the feelings that you had with with your dad I mean did you go through anger like even when he was like wanting to spend time with your grandkids uh like you know why didn't you want to spend time with me um uh they say that time to kids like time is love right if you are present you can spend time did you go through some of that even were you aware of any of that in your teens or 20s like where you're like you know why you maybe you saw someone else's dad and they had a decent relationship with their son you're like you know why you know I don't have that with my Dad yeah interestingly enough I didn't have a whole lot of that okay what I've realized as I've gotten older is that I just stuffed all that you know I stuffed all the emotions I stuffed all the experience and so I had a a very difficult set of teen years uh very rebellious lots of uh acting out and just not not a smooth sailing that's for sure um and then in my 20s I I really had a life-changing Encounter With Jesus that that made a difference for me going into the 20s but then in my late 20s um I this was a real moment for me I was living in Nashville at the time and um and I was dealing with some depression and anger and just a lot of stuff and trying to kind of figure it out and I was out one night walking my dog and just talking to God and and and I'm just like what in the world do do something like you know help me and and in that moment it began I began to realize part of what was missing was I lost my whole childhood like I I didn't have a childhood and you know even as a young child mom and dad had issues and when dad was in the home he wasn't really present he would be there but he wasn't actually present um and so in my late 20s it hit me what all I had lost I I think I was acting out because of it all through my teens you know and then struggled some with those things in my in my 20s but I never had that oh gosh I wish I had a better relationship with my dad oh gosh I wish you know I could do things with him like other kids I really didn't do that but when I got to the kind of the end of my 20s I had a real uh shattering kind of moment where it's like gosh I got messed over I didn't get what every kid deserves every kid deserves to live with their mom and dad and to have a home and to have a family and to that's what every kid deserves and that got robbed it got taken from me and so that was a real you know moment for me and and it really took some time to process that reality and And the emotions that I had hidden for so long um but it it you know it it was the beginning of the healing process for me yeah yeah no thanks for sharing your story um I know it's uh it's probably difficult just to strive through some of those experiences but obviously healing um we our audience is a lot of entrepreneurs business owners uh guys that are leaders hard Chargers and again I think one of the things that I see men even in this Arena is just the if they're passive anywhere it's typically in their home right as a husband or as a father that we can pursue very uh hard certain things in our life but then also be extremely passive in our own homes you know and you wrote this particular book um being the dad that you wish you had five Stones let's just talk about effective healthy being a dad sometimes you know men that are listen to this may like I I have so much going on it's just it's so hard um my mind's always turning I can't slow down I can't shut it off I can't be present maybe take a stone and I know you you've been in that in your own life right yeah so talk to us about uh this yeah I think one of the things that it is the first stone of the book and and it's that it's just the power of being and and I talk about how much influence dads have and how much power they have and and I really tie back into my experience with my father that you know as I've been describing here we weren't like super super close and after a really hard break because after that you know obviously after he threatened to kill us we never you Mom and Dad divorced and but even with the disconnect that he and I had and the distance that we had his life impacted mine and when I look back over my life I see characteristics in me that are there because of my father and and good things I mean there's some bad things too but let's focus on the good for a minute right but um I think that's one of the things you know for fathers that part of what I want to say in this book is you are having a huge impact whether you're trying or not whether you're doing well or not you are impacting your kids for better or worse and I'm hoping to give dad's hope that even if you're a train wreck like I would say my father would not have won any fatherhood Awards and yet he left me some positive Legacy and so I want dads to have that sense of wow I made not be doing it all right but I still have power in my kids life I'm still having influence in my kids lives and then if I tweak that just a little bit how much more influence could I have I mean I'm GNA have influence regardless so if I just change it just a little it's going to make such a difference I mean one of the things that I I love to think about in relation to business is that sometimes it's not these huge big changes that take you from this level to that level you know there's really it's a small something it it's it's 1% more it's just a little bit more yeah that'll push you on over that edge you know that that will get the ball rolling for you and I think fatherhood is like that I I we're not ever going to be perfect fathers I'm certainly not a perfect father uh if you find one please send him to me I'd like to interview him but um you know we're not perfect dads but if we just put a little more attention on it it can become exponentially better and I think that's a lot of what the book is about is being intentional yeah no definitely I love what you talked about just the small changes uh just small uh pivots and I was talking to uh a guy who mentors me a little bit and I said I'm really good at the big things I'm really good at the big things I can do the dad camps and and the daddy daughter camps the dadson camps I can take him camping uh coach their teams whatever that looks like I can do the big things but I really struggle with the small things I struggle with the day-to-day consistency of some of those small things and um an example was my one son he's he's our middle child and my wife told me the other day that he doesn't ever say he loves you to her back or he doesn't ever say he loves you like maybe he's uh um she'll say I love you all the time but he never really responds never really says it back and I was kind of thinking about that and and I wondered and I I tell him I I love him but same but same thing and uh so last night I really got you know on his level and you know looked him looked at him as my son and looked him in the eyes and said I just want to let you know that and I I'm really proud of you and I'm and I really and I'm I love you so much and then he says it back you know but I think it's just those small things maybe it's just how we're doing that it's just a small thing we're saying the same things but maybe it's how we say it right it's how we approach it at the same time right absolutely yeah and it's not all about the response too and maybe you can talk about that like because sometimes you know we we expect a response oh if I do this then this will happen um but sometimes the kids don't respond can you talk about that like in your own life in your own fatherhood uh of the struggling father that you know I'm trying to do these things but my kids still are not responding yeah I think that is a very interesting question because I mean it's just a part of it and especially I don't know well that that's not a really true statement I was going to say I think it might be worse with boys I've got two boys and two girls and you know I find the boys are a little more hesitant or unlikely to to respond with you know all I love you or the girls are a little little more touchy feely but then I realized one of my daughters like in the middle of her like 11 to 13 like I couldn't have gotten a positive word out of her no matter what I did you know I mean it's just was GNA happen yes because of where she was and so I think part of that is is on us we just got to realize that we're the adults and the relationship you know we're the dads and so we just keep giving the love we keep giving the in the you know the positive reinforcement we we're the ones who are there to support them and and at the end of the day that really is the bottom line my kids don't really owe me anything I'm responsible to rear them in a effective Godly manner so that they can be the people that God wants them to be and they don't really owe me anything for that you know and so I think the more we can kind of come to that that this is really this is my job you know I'm the dad and so I'm the one who's going to be giving and if I get if I get something back man that's great you know and and I love that I when I was writing this book I told the story just recently but when I was writing this book uh actually I think the story is in the book um in the middle of of the night of writing my son comes and I was sitting in a kind of an oversized chair in the living room and and he was playing the game on on his tablet or something and and so he came and just sat in this chair with me which there wasn't room for both of us you know like didn't work and I had to scoot way over and my laptop's kind of hanging off my lap and I'm trying to work and I've got notes and you know he just wanted to be close yeah and and he didn't really even say anything he just came and joined me in my space and you know man what a great feeling that was yeah no I love that I love that there's a mixture between I think as dads we want our kids to listen to us and to respect us us and it's funny again business owner entrepreneur I think this is why men gravitate towards their work especially guys that I struggle with that I that I Mentor is because they get respected like you know and if they don't get respected you're out they're gone right and then they don't and then they don't get respect at their at their home so sometimes you know I want you to talk about how does a father kind of have that balance between right having the fun because I think you know we were even talking the other day you were out I think playing in the snow with your kids I was like oh you know he's having a lot of fun with his kids but also mixed with wisdom and respect um what does that look like in your in your own family yeah I think that is man one of one of the chapters one of actually one of the big Stones is being lovable and it's really what you're talking about there's two or three chapters there about as dads we're used to being kind of the bottom line and we're used to being authoritarian or you know disciplinarian or whatever kinds of and like man like you point out I think is so important if you are the leader of an organization you just get used to people doing what you ask them to do right you know and if it if they don't there's just a problem this is not going to work well and and so then when you come home it doesn't always look like that um and so one of the things that I think is so important is to think about what are we looking for long term you know I'm not really trying to raate somebody said this to me recently and I love it I'm not trying to raise kids I'm trying to raise healthy adults yeah and and so to keep your eye on what is it we're going for I I it's not about this moment it's about a lifetime and so when I'm interacting with my kids one of the things I've got to try to do is remember that it's not just about today it's about who are they going to be in 10 years or 15 years and what do I want to put into their life and how do I accomplish that and and for me you know it's it's relationship it's having long-term relationship my goal was not to get my kids to 18 and push them out of my house um my goal is to get to 18 20 40 and still have relationship with them to be you know connected and one of the things that I really am loving right now is that one of my daughters is working with me uh in in the writing and the promoting of my books and and and helping run the camp and it's like we're together every day you know see each other all the time and and there's relationship ship M and then my other daughter my my daughters are my older kids my boys are still in middle school and then my daughters are both out of college and my other daughter says that I'm one of her best friends well you know that's what I wanted I I want to have relationship with my kids they don't have to work with me they don't have to consider me their best friend but I want to be in their life and I want to be their friend and so in those moments every day I have to think about how do I want to treat this child so that I don't break relationships so that I capture their heart and and I keep their heart and and we have longterm ongoing healthy relationship and of course that that changes I I talk about that in the book as well that there's different stages and at each stage my kids need something different from me so I'm not trying to be my three-year-old's friend right that's not what I'm supposed to be doing I I want to be my 20- year-old's friend right I want to be my three-year-old's disciplinarian you know yeah and so just those pieces so when I come home you know that's the piece I'm looking for is how can I be lovable how can I admit my faults how can I admit when I make a mistake how can I you know make sure they know how much I'm for them and just those those issues no I love that I love that it kind of goes back to this saying again uh um you can't have corre C if you don't have connection that's one of things Andy Stanley wrote a book parenting getting it right and he was obviously talking a lot about just their relationship and he even talked about one of his goals was to have adult children that want to be with them when they don't have to be right um absolutely yeah so uh in one chapter in your book you talk about dad as a yard stick and you mentioned this concept of the father being a yarn a yard stick for their children can you talk about this like what does this what does this exactly mean um well you know I think our our kids are always looking to us to see who to be and how to be and you know it's back to that reference I made about about my dad and the positives that I've learned from him that just being with him you know he was a very generous man my father was um probably rarely moved above uh you know kind of a baseline poverty level salary never really had a lot of money he was a mechanic or a machinist at a bowan alley and I mean just minimum wage maybe slightly above for the majority of his life and yet I watched him give in kind of extraordinary ways I can remember being in the bowling alley with him and they were taking up a collection from for somebody who had had a I don't even really know what had happened a death or a sickness or anyway they were taking up a collection for somebody that was a you know regular at the bowling alley and he pulled out an and I would lie if I told you I know what this is memory is terrible anyway it's not very trustworthy but it in my mind looking back on it was probably a $100 bill because it was huge and it like I can remember gasping inside and thinking wow like wow wow and and and I knew then that he didn't have any money you know what I'm saying I mean like this were my teen years and so I mean I knew that he was living kind of just very much on on the bottom but he was generous and that is something that I try to model in my life that I try to take care of of of people around me I try to give to folks who need you know I try to be generous with you know all kinds of different ways and so that's come from my father so he was a yard stick for me something that I've kind of measured myself against and then you know take that a step further is that we're setting helping our family and especially our children to establish values you know what's important to them and you know again there's there's a good grief how many there's bunches and bunches of things that are valuable and in each chapter of the book I I give a little section that you can kind of do some reflection on and and in the chapter about values I list a whole bunch of values and kind of help guys walk through you know what's five to seven values that I want to have in my life because you can't value everything or you don't value anything you know you can't I can't pass on 40 values to my kids right if I really work on passing on three or four five or six I may be able to do that and so you know as a as a yard stick you're trying to say to your kids here are the things that are important and this this is something that as a family we really believe in and and you know my wife and I talked about that when the kids were really young what are what are important things to us what are things that we want to pass on to our children and and how are we going to do that um we took both of the girls on a missions trip when they were like four and six and we went and took gifts to orphanages and you know because what we wanted to pass on to them is we want to care about the world we want to make a difference in people's lives we want to take our faith globally you know that was a value and we were very intentional and spent you know money to make sure that those values were modeled to our to our children and so when when we're talking about being a yard stick that's a part of it is you know helping them see the things that are important and giving them something to measure yeah no that's good I I don't think you can start off too early with that this is just something recently that that my wife and we've been talking about is again you know take your last name for example like what are the snod grasses all about or what are the atoms all about um and coming up with mantras and uh love that yeah so one of the things that my my kids are they range from 17 to five and then my two boys so I got two girls and two boys too my two girls are on the end my two boys are eight and 10 in the middle and the one thing I've been talking about more and more is the Snodgrass is are always better together so and That Could That Could relate to if they're arguing about something if they're not sharing for the little kids or um they don't want to play with with somebody else right you know and and I just I don't have to discipline I just say you know what the snag grasses are always better together so that's awesome so just things like that I would just encourage you listener out there I think what Nick's talking about too is just like you know what is your family all about what do you want to pass on doesn't have to be 40 things but just is there a couple um at the end of the day so that's fun um you talk in your book about just this reflection pool and you refer to the dad as as this reflection um can you talk about that a little bit and I think you obviously identity is a piece of that possibly but talk to us about like the dad is this reflection pool the children I think in in our culture we're always being told who we are you know and we're getting all this feedback about what it means to be all kinds of things a guy or an athlete or it doesn't you know whatever you want to say there's always this reflection that's coming back to us from the culture around us and so the point of that chapter is to say as dads we have so much power and so much influence and so if we'll take that and be a healthy refle ction pull back to our children so that we can tell them what they we can let them see what they really look like we can let them see what the real value is and you know one of the the easiest examples of that is my oldest son um is like he is a really intuitive sensitive um Social Animal like he's just he's really good and my youngest son has some some disabilities some learning disabilities and and my older son is always you know kind of looking out for him and trying to help him navigate life and really help us I I mean I remember so distinctly I had the two boys I was taking them on a trip just Dad and the boys and um and my younger son he if he doesn't if everything isn't very regulated and consistent he really struggles and so he was kind of melting down and and I was hungry and he was hungry and it was a bad it was just bad and so I'm like if you you got to stop you got to quiet you know you just got to quit and and I was getting more and more ramped up and and just on the verge of you know being a extremely unhealthy father right and and my son who's like I mean he might have been six or seven says to my younger son hey what's your favorite color and so instead of like this thing I'm doing of back and forth with him he just distracts him which was the absolute like that's what a psychologist would have told you to do I mean it was just yeah brilliant you know I'm like like I have a masters and couldn't figure that out and my seven-year-old like oh let's do this you know but but he's he's he's just very intuitive he's very people or and he's and he's sensitive well you know you know that being a 13-year-old boy and being being sensitive isn't necessarily your your leading trait you know it's not the one you you know it's not the one you come out with first you I'm a sensitive guy right um so one of the things I try to do is just to reflect back to him how positive that is and how you know what the fact that you're sensitive you're going to have healthy relationships and you're going to be able to be a great husband and you're going to be able to have deep relationships with your friends and because you're able to own your emotions and to to really just to be a very real human and and that is awesome and so I try to reflect the positive of that back to him so that when his friends are like oh wow you're being sensitive or you know or whatever negative thing comes out there that he's got a little bit of reinforcement to go okay I mean maybe I was being too sensitive in that moment but sensitivity isn't a bad thing you know and so with some perspect perspective of years hopefully as dads we've we've lived long enough we've seen enough in life that we have a little more perspective than our 13-year-old son and and we can just give him that perspective you know of here's what I see when when you do that or say that I want you to know what I'm seeing you know and recently he told me this said Dad I've got something I need to tell you and I'm like and I could just tell the way he said it's like this is going to be I'm like oh gosh like okay like I've need to tell you for about six weeks and I'm like okay and and then he he launches into the story but what I was able to say to him is because you're able to be honest man like that just makes me trust you all the more because you're and so I'm just reflecting back to him the good things in his life and and what they do for other people no I love that I love that um so such a great book and uh we we touched on a couple of of the stones here and uh it just again it's it I would encourage father's uh dads to to dig in being the dad that you wish you had and as we wrap up the show here uh Nick I want you to sometimes I think for me so my again I got different elements my daughter's getting ready to turn 17 so now it's starting to become pretty real we're like oh wow when did that come about I I only have one year left what do I want this year to look like with her for example but then there's young young kids and it's like you know men are in the trenches I had a call the other day uh one of my friends has 5-year-old three-year-old and he was talking about man this is just really hard they have some different challenges um how how would you just encourage the struggling fathers that are just kind of like in the trenches where they're like they don't they don't see the light right now right they don't see oh I got a year left I got to get it together I got they're like wow how long is this gonna be chaotic in my home and and I just want that piece can you speak to them um as a dad as a as a leader speak to the struggling dads just in the trenches right now oh man I think one of the first thoughts I had as you were saying that is just the good news is it will pass you know I mean things just change and and I've had moments in my own life actually I had one just recently because my my mom is uh broken her hip and I'm trying to take care of her and I've got you know a special needs son and I've got it just businesses and all the stuff going on and I mean I I about had a meltdown recently and and it just the reality that I mean in that moment it seemed like there was not going to be a future you know and and and now I can't even really remember what it's such a big deal and we're just talking about three weeks ago and it's like I don't what was my problem that's no big deal and and I know the thing that happens to us is sometimes they they last way longer than that and and you are in those trenches and and I think just to know that that nothing lasts forever it's going to change things will level out be different even if it's not better it'll be different sometimes just the new challenge is better uh but in the middle of that gosh be kind to yourself you know because again a big thing that I want people to get out of this book is it's not being perfect it's making progress and so just be kind to yourself and just acknowledge wow and and and I love to to acknowledge it to my kids wow I really messed that up wow I wish I had done that differently and that's not the end of the world you know and and and so as a dad just to take a deep breath and go okay I may not be doing X Y and Z perfectly but I am moving toward one of them you know I'm at least leaning in to X you know Y and Z aren't even on the radar yet but I'm at least doing a little better here man take that and go because it isn't about being perfect it's about making progress and and you know kind of every day just being kind to yourself and saying wow I'm making a difference in my kids life because I'm showing up every day yeah and maybe I'm not the perfect dad but when I come home I give him a hug I give him a kiss I look him in the eyes okay that's that's great man that is a big step down the road and so I think we can get so hung up and one of the things I didn't want this book to be was another 20 things you need to do to be a good dad like really it's I want to encourage you that you have power you have influence and and it's every time you make a little change and make a little bit of progress It's powerful yeah yeah that's awesome well Nick thanks for uh thanks for being on the podcast today this has been amazing I appreciate you uh so much make sure if you're listening in to go get being the dad that you wish you had um such an amazing book any anything that you want to share if someone wants to reach out to you I know you're doing uh like I said you got youth camps um have you're a writer you're uh have this book you're coming out with other books uh speaking things of that nature how can someone get a hold of you and look you up?  - Sure. One of the easiest ways is info being- and so that that comes to me and so people want information about the book or they just want to chat about something that's happening in their you know their family or whatever's going on that's that's a way to reach out awesome sounds good we're going to put that in our show notes on our website and also on our YouTube channel and appreciate you Nick for being with us today. And that's a wrap. God bless you!  - Well I appreciate it very much, Brett. I've enjoyed being with you and your... your whole group of folks - listeners.  - Thank you we'll see you guys next time.